Threads / Could Randy Moss catch, and pass, Jerry Rice???
Its certainly possible. I know many will dismiss it immediately, esp those who have never really cared for Moss, but as it stands right now it is my opinion (and many others) that Moss is the 2nd best WR to ever play the game. A case can be made for the best, it would be tough right now though.
But with the revitalization of Moss' career while playing alongside Brady and Welker, could he put up enough numbers to actually be the best WR to ever play? I certainly think its possible. Lets just take a look, see what needs to happen, and see how they stand as of right now:
****Randy Moss: 179 gms, 901 rec (5 rpg), 14092 yds (78.7 ypg), 142 TD's
****Jerry Rice: 303 gms, 1549 rec (5.1 rpg), 22895 yds (75.6 ypg), 197 TD's
Ok, so its clear that Rice is def. well ahead of him statistically, but as you see in terms of efficiency per game Moss is right there with Rice, and if he can push 300 gms he could push Rice's legacy.
More importantly, here is what Moss has done since having Brady pass to him...
****Randy Moss: 25 gms, 158 rec (6.3 rpg), 2384 yds (95.4 ypg), 30 TD's
As we can see, Moss has been downright DOMINANT since joining Brady, and honestly it does not look like he has slowed down at all or will. Remember, Rice played until he was 42 yrs old, Moss right now is just 32. But lets speculate for a moment.
Imagine that Brady and Moss have 4 more seasons (+7 gms left this yr), that would give Moss 71 more games played, and at the pace he is at now with Brady here is a rough estimate of what he could put up.
****Randy Moss: 250 gms, 1350 rec, 20863 yds, 227 TD's
That def puts Moss in the discussion, and to be quite honest i could see those numbers being enough, but what if they go longer? I mean Brady is just 32 as well, how about 5 seasons?
****Randy Moss: 266 gms, 1451 rec, 22388 yds, 246 TD's
Ok, so that puts him over the top if you ask me, but what if they do the unprecedented and get 6 more seasons in?
****Randy Moss: 282 gms, 1552 rec, 23914 yds, 265 TD's
Now, dont get me wrong, it would take something amazing for Moss to push those last numbers, asking a guy to put up roughly 1600 yds a season btwn the ages of 33-39 is pretty ridiculous, so there will def. be some natural regression with age, but the first set of numbers are certainly in question. And if Moss can take a back seat to pride, he could possibly sit in and play until he's roughly 40 and put up decent numbers, similar to Rice, and maybe allow him to get those finals numbers.
The point is, Randy Moss could very well be the greatest WR to ever play the game when his career is all said and done, and imo he will go down with that title.
But with the revitalization of Moss' career while playing alongside Brady and Welker, could he put up enough numbers to actually be the best WR to ever play? I certainly think its possible. Lets just take a look, see what needs to happen, and see how they stand as of right now:
****Randy Moss: 179 gms, 901 rec (5 rpg), 14092 yds (78.7 ypg), 142 TD's
****Jerry Rice: 303 gms, 1549 rec (5.1 rpg), 22895 yds (75.6 ypg), 197 TD's
Ok, so its clear that Rice is def. well ahead of him statistically, but as you see in terms of efficiency per game Moss is right there with Rice, and if he can push 300 gms he could push Rice's legacy.
More importantly, here is what Moss has done since having Brady pass to him...
****Randy Moss: 25 gms, 158 rec (6.3 rpg), 2384 yds (95.4 ypg), 30 TD's
As we can see, Moss has been downright DOMINANT since joining Brady, and honestly it does not look like he has slowed down at all or will. Remember, Rice played until he was 42 yrs old, Moss right now is just 32. But lets speculate for a moment.
Imagine that Brady and Moss have 4 more seasons (+7 gms left this yr), that would give Moss 71 more games played, and at the pace he is at now with Brady here is a rough estimate of what he could put up.
****Randy Moss: 250 gms, 1350 rec, 20863 yds, 227 TD's
That def puts Moss in the discussion, and to be quite honest i could see those numbers being enough, but what if they go longer? I mean Brady is just 32 as well, how about 5 seasons?
****Randy Moss: 266 gms, 1451 rec, 22388 yds, 246 TD's
Ok, so that puts him over the top if you ask me, but what if they do the unprecedented and get 6 more seasons in?
****Randy Moss: 282 gms, 1552 rec, 23914 yds, 265 TD's
Now, dont get me wrong, it would take something amazing for Moss to push those last numbers, asking a guy to put up roughly 1600 yds a season btwn the ages of 33-39 is pretty ridiculous, so there will def. be some natural regression with age, but the first set of numbers are certainly in question. And if Moss can take a back seat to pride, he could possibly sit in and play until he's roughly 40 and put up decent numbers, similar to Rice, and maybe allow him to get those finals numbers.
The point is, Randy Moss could very well be the greatest WR to ever play the game when his career is all said and done, and imo he will go down with that title.
, FL
When it's all said and done I do think Randy Moss will end up being the best wide receiver in NFL history in terms of efficiency.
Its pretty spectacular to see what he has been able to do, its too bad he ever went to Oakland or this would prob be pretty much known already.
, MN
I don't think there's a question that he's the most talented WR ever to play already. But, with his style, I just don't see him continuing the pace he's been on w/Brady for much more than 2-3 years. He's a vertical WR, and as he ages, he's sure to lose some of his jumping ability and speed. That's where Rice has the edge. He could be vertical, but he was also damn good across the middle and precision route running.
, CA
A couple things...
1. You bumped...HAHAHA
2. You actually posted in the right section...WTF?
3. This would all be assuming that he stays on the exact same path that he is going on now. I do agree with you that Moss easily has a chance to pass Rice as becoming the best WR of all time, but then again, who's to say that Hutson isn't better than Moss? =)
Either way, Moss is already number 2 and that's a fact. Its too bad people who hate him and can't stand his attitude are blinded by how good he actually is.
1. You bumped...HAHAHA
2. You actually posted in the right section...WTF?
3. This would all be assuming that he stays on the exact same path that he is going on now. I do agree with you that Moss easily has a chance to pass Rice as becoming the best WR of all time, but then again, who's to say that Hutson isn't better than Moss? =)
Either way, Moss is already number 2 and that's a fact. Its too bad people who hate him and can't stand his attitude are blinded by how good he actually is.
He doesnt have to stay the exact same for all those yrs, right now he is on pace for 1600 yds, id say 1500 is more realistic. Say he declines by 200 yds each season (which i dont think will happen) for 4 seasons...that gives him another 600 this season, 1300 nxt, 1100, then 900...thats another 4900 yds receiving. That puts him at 19000 for his career, and he will pass Rice's TD record imo...
Pretty amazing.
Pretty amazing.
The TD record is done with.
The weirdest part is, if LT can actually stay healthy, I thought that he could have broke Rice's TD record.
Its sad that people only remember Moss' 2nd year in Oakland and not his first.
The weirdest part is, if LT can actually stay healthy, I thought that he could have broke Rice's TD record.
Its sad that people only remember Moss' 2nd year in Oakland and not his first.
, NC
Just think if he did not have to spend a few years in the wasteland known as Oakland. He could put up huge stats. Rice had a very long career so I don't know if he will ever catch him in overall stats but his talent will rival Rice.
I think he has a great shot to be known as the #1 in the general media.
I think he has a great shot to be known as the #1 in the general media.
, WA
I agree with you and would love to see it happen. Moss has become a model citizen since joining the Pats and if he can stay healthy and has the desire, he surely can play until he's 40. I'm sure that Moss has thought about the record and I'm sure he is working hard to achieve it. Based on his performance this year, which in some games has been down right dominant, he is showing no indication of slowing down. With the way Moss takes care of himself, it is quite possible he can make a run at Jerry Rice!
Oh, I thought you meant in a foot race right now and I was going to say, "sure he can"
- topic at hand, IMO yes he can - I don't know about statistically speaking, but I've never seen a player adjust to the ball in flight better than Moss - How many times have you seen him apparently "blanketed" only to make an easy catch and, usually, a td out of it. He's a freak of nature as far as pure talent goes and, despite what people have said over the years, he works hard at his craft...that much is obvious.
- topic at hand, IMO yes he can - I don't know about statistically speaking, but I've never seen a player adjust to the ball in flight better than Moss - How many times have you seen him apparently "blanketed" only to make an easy catch and, usually, a td out of it. He's a freak of nature as far as pure talent goes and, despite what people have said over the years, he works hard at his craft...that much is obvious.
Moss has some of the greatest hands ive ever seen, by that i mean pretty much what you do, but there are times where he adjusts and the DB still gets his hands all over Moss and the ball and he still snatches it...or like against Miami when he snagged it 1 handed against his shoulder with 3 guys draped all over him, he's insanely talented and prob the greatest ive ever seen. There are other guys who could do more in terms of route running and all that, but i would take Moss' athleticism, versatility, and ability to stretch the field over anyone.
man...I love reading the responses to your thread, and of course your subsequent response - awesome, just awesome. So far I see you've controlled yourself nicely...can't wait for that to end
Im a new man Jeff, mild mannered, calm, patient, etc etc...
Naaaa im jerking your chain, fuck that. Ill get wild eventually.
Naaaa im jerking your chain, fuck that. Ill get wild eventually.
What?!!? You just actually spelled out the word "fuck"? Thats like the first time ive ever seen this!
yeah yeah - Owner and I had a convo about this very subject. I explained that I do indeed swear, and quite often but 90% of the time I'm on here I'm at work, and oft-times on the phone with, well, pretty important people - at least to our company - i.e. managers, ceo's, presidents so I try go keep a "clean" frame of mind. I don't need to let a "Fuck-tard" slip out while discussing distribution of 20,000 units in Ontario, or whatever.
first no matter what happens rice is THE greatest...he helped two QBs to the hall of fame...second, michael irvin is next in line and believe me he was more dominant than moss ever was...the thing most people look for is SB rings....and rice and Irvin OWN that...now if somehow he wins 3 or 4 rings(which might happen because of brady) then he could be in the convo...but every dominant WR has won SB rings and moss hasnt...troy brown has more of a right to be considered a great WR with 3 rings....both rice and irvin have 3 rings, respectively....moss is a good WR but brady makes him...without brady he would post up roughly 1000 yards and 8 TDs...his numbers dropped significantly when brady wasnt there...and Irvin definitely helped aikman post up such great numbers...and rice turned young who lead the league in INTs when he was with the bucs into the ONLY left-handed hall of famer....i really like moss, esp. on my fantasy teams...but moss is nowhere near the top 15
Dude, you really need get off of this Super Bowl ring kick, Troy Brown wont even sniff the hall of fame nor should he, he was not that good, just b/c he won rings means nothing.
Rice is the 2nd greatest ALREADY, end of discussion.
Rice is the 2nd greatest ALREADY, end of discussion.
I think you meant Moss not Rice. But anyway I agree super bowls have nothing to do with how great an individual player is at any given position. Using that retarded logic he is saying that Barry Sanders isn't any good. Don't get me wrong I am not going to crown him the greatest ever but he is def in the top 10(generalizing because i don't want to debate this). How is this possible if he has no super bowl rings? Moss is a freak end of story and could one day be conidered the best ever. Root and nom.
no rice is THE best...im just saying good wrs win rings....moss has actually kept his team from winning them...im just saying troy brown was a more consistent target than moss
Well youre an idiot, Moss has not kept his team from winning and Troy Brown was not more consistent you stupid fuck.
what im saying is that if troy brown can win 3 rings with brady and moss cant win 1 ring with a way better team than brown had then he i not that dominate...moss is not dominate hes good but he surely isnt dominate...he is a one trick pony...moss isnt even the best of HIS time more or less of all time...larry fitz and andre johnson are way better...Rice was the best WR for 18 years and moss was the best for that one year (when brady threw 50 tds)
It's going to take him a lot of consistency and longevity to come close in my opinion. It's unreal to think that he will play four more seasons with Tom Brady without missing any games.
Why is that unreal? Moss has never really been injured, Brady has just once, both are showing absolutely no signs of slowing up. I think its EASILY 4 more seasons.
, SC
I agree with you, Moss could very well be #1 someday. He has such amazing talent, and if he and Brady both stay on the same path they are on now they will no doubt have the chance. But we have to take in several factors like will he stay healthy, will Brady stay healthy, and he may just lose it when he turns 35 or 36. It's going to be exciting to see how he does in the next 5 or so seasons. We could be witnessing history. Good Job!
, TX
Just imagine if he hadn't of been stuck in that Black Hole we now know as the Raiders for two years.
Jerry Rice is not only the greatest wide receiver to ever play the game, he is the greatest football player ever to play. Rice has virtually doubled the record book. When he broke in the NFL record for touchdown receptions was 101, he retired with 197. That would be like someone doubling Babe Ruth's 714 homeruns, taking that record to 1,428. Jerry Rice's work ethic is un-parrelled, to even think of Randy Moss the malcontent in the same plateau is not think clearly. Moss takes plays off, he quit on teams (Vikings and Raiders), he has exceptional talent, but doesn't always apply it. Jerry Rice was a role model, a team player, a 3 time Superbowl champion. I don't beleive his records will ever be broken. Receivers die quickly, just look at Marvin Harrison. Rice's 1,549 receptions; 22,895 receiving yards and 197 touchdown recpetions (207 total) will NEVER be equalled. Moss was born 2/13/1977 he has 2 very productive years left and then he will begin to lose a step. Jerry Rice the greatest football player to ever live.
Rice is certainly not the greatest football player ever, though damn near close, but the greatest ever has to be Montana or Lawrence Taylor, imo.
Though i completely understand your point of view, and its not far fetched, Rice is def. top 5.
Though i completely understand your point of view, and its not far fetched, Rice is def. top 5.
If Randy had not had the lost years on Oakland your theory would be very very valid.
He could have gotten say 15 TD per year with a Good QB......added to his present total....Plus add say 17 if Tom was throwing to him last season...and he could very well pass the all time TD leader....in 3 more seasons
Which to me would be the most likely title/record he would take away from the ALL time Best WR.....Mr Rice.
He could have gotten say 15 TD per year with a Good QB......added to his present total....Plus add say 17 if Tom was throwing to him last season...and he could very well pass the all time TD leader....in 3 more seasons
Which to me would be the most likely title/record he would take away from the ALL time Best WR.....Mr Rice.
I agree and I'm not just saying that because it's on my team. I've been a Moss fan since he was with the Raiders. Even though some people may disagree, he does kick in when you need him and he's, for the most part, a wonderful play maker.
, 
, RI
I argue completely i dont think he will get them career numbers but his per game numbers are just going up and up.... With his new found attitude in NE and playing with Brady i see no reason why he cant match Rice..
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